G+_earlsquareling Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 I have two tplink routers connected via a tplink switch. One provides wifi for my private network (2 year old archer c7) and the other provides wifi for my guest network ($20 router 2.4ghz only). Before i moved both networks worked fine. The routers sat on a shelf about 2-3 feet away from each other. Channels for both routers set to auto. Never had any speed issues. After moving to a new house, I've had periods of time where wifi is less than 1Mbps on the 2.4ghz wifi. Sometimes only my private network, sometimes both my private and guest network. The 5ghz network seems to not be affected, although i have to be very close to get a signal. I assume that the wired traffic is still good if the 5ghz is still running fine. I Don't have anything directly wired to test it. Whenever I restarted my routers the speed was back to normal. I thought maybe someone somehow got into my network and was leeching off my wifi but i saw no foreign devices in my routers client list. I tried wifi spectrum analyzer and changed the two routers channels to opposite ends (I believe one was 3 and the other 9 or somewhere around there to account for any bleeding over channels). Didnt work. None of the neighbors wifi signals were too strong so i dont think it was the neighbors. In case it was the neighbors, i moved the routers to the center of my house. Still no luck. Since both routers are acting up i dont believe its a faulty router. I tried moving them apart by putting one on a table and one on the floor. Its a little better but not much. All i know is this dual router setup never had a problem for the last 8 months in my old house sitting on the same shelf right next to each other. Any advice? If it is 2.4ghz interference then why did it work flawlessly before? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Ben Reese Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 I'm a bit curious about how they're connected. You mentioned a switch... Is the switch between the modem and routers or just between the two routers? If just between the two routers, you're only using 1 cable, right? Is DHCP enabled on both routers? Sorry for all the questions. Hard to know what exactly is happening. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_earlsquareling Posted January 19, 2016 Author Share Posted January 19, 2016 Im new to google + and i swear i clicked post to reply to you. But i dont see it so ill try again. The modem is connected to the switch. The switch then connects to the wan ports on both routers. They are parallel nats, not nested. They each have their own dhcp as i dont intend for them to talk to each other. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Jason Marsh Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 It could be a number of things. Different construction or insulation in new house, a greater number of 2.4ghz devices causing interference or a single device with a really janky radio, differences in foliage/trees around the structure, everything, seriously.. are you much closer to a radar installation? If you can, go all 5GHz. I know, I can't either.. With WiFi Analyzer, were all three channels (1,6,11) in use or being walked on by nearby devices on adjacent channels? 2.4GHz is murder. What happens if you shut one router down; can you get decent WiFi from the other? Why not just use the Archer to provide both private and guest nets? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Thomas Brisco Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 Sounds more like a Wifi signal issue than a DHCP issue. earlsquareling - do you see the speed drop off more as you walk away from them? I'm thinking some 2.4GHz noise sources (local walkie talkies, microwave ovens, etc etc) - especially since you said the 5GHz band doesn't seem effected. I use "iperf" to measure local throughput - usually looking for these types of problems. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Thomas Brisco Posted January 19, 2016 Share Posted January 19, 2016 Jason Marsh if it's house/wall construction, shouldn't 5GHz be affected more than 2.4? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_earlsquareling Posted January 19, 2016 Author Share Posted January 19, 2016 When i turn one off the other works so im sure its one interfering with the other but it wasnt a problem in the old house even though they were right next to each other. I did wifi analysis and chose the best channels. The neighbors signals arent too high. I do live close to a small airport now. Maybe 5 miles away. But before i was 10 miles away from an international airport. Idk if that makes a difference. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Black Merc Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 earlsquareling are you in line of the runway(do planes fly over the house in/out bound)? If so bad location... planes use directional radio beams to line up for landing in fog or other nasty weather. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_earlsquareling Posted January 20, 2016 Author Share Posted January 20, 2016 I dont think its that bad. I occasionally hear a plane nearby but its not that often. Like i said, its a small airport so there is not much traffic. But still it doesnt really explain why the routers work fine when is turned off. Half of the time they work fine when both are on. I'm about ready to give up on this. Think I might just go back to 1 router. Whole reason i got a guest router was because my iptv box doesnt allow me to put in all the symbols in my steve gibson level wifi password. Its long but its easy for me to remember. I know the c7 can do guest network as well but i was pretty sure that it (or maybe others I've heard of) doesnt totally separate the two networks so there is a possibility for someone malicious joined on the guest network to get their mits on the private network. I'm prepping the basement to be my man cave and maybe I'll try one last setup with the c7 in the basement and the guest router upstairs. I wonder if them being on top of each other would still cause problems. I am only really capable of separating the floors they are on, but not much moving them to opposite sides of the house. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Ben Reese Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 It sounds like you've already checked everything, so hard to say what the issue is. And they both start to drop out after a time, or just one? I agree that the airport shouldn't have little to do with it. I'm less than a mile from a small airport and pretty much in line with one of the runways. Haven't had any noticeable issues when planes fly over. I do have interference from neighboring WiFi, but I'm down to 1 2.4GHz Hotspot and 1 5GHz Hotspot. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_earlsquareling Posted January 20, 2016 Author Share Posted January 20, 2016 Yeah the speed slows down to a crawl for long periods. Might as well be dialup. It ends up remediating itself if you leave it long enough. When im gaming (on my phone) with both routers on and the problem comes back my ping will sometimes average around 500ms. The most ive seen was like 40k ms. So when i decide to game i either go to lte or turn off 1 router. Turning off 1 router always solves the problem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Jason Marsh Posted January 20, 2016 Share Posted January 20, 2016 So, what channels are you using again? You can only slice 2.4GHz into three (4 outside US) non-overlapping channels. If your neighbors are on anything other than 1, 6, or 11, you have NO clear channels to use. Unless you want to move one to 14 by telling your AP and devices you're in Japan. What happens if you put one AP on 5GHz only, and the other on 2.4GHz only? Do they function fine then? 5GHz has been around long enough that only my older iPod Touch needs 2.4GHz. Well, maybe the wife's laptop, as well. If you setup like that, could you live with the less-capable devices living only on the 2.4GHz (guestnet)? I just thought of this.. you or someone nearby could be using wide channels on 2.4GHz. Is your ISP modem also a WiFi AP? If so, try to turn off wireless on that. If it's the ISP's modem, you might only be able to turn off "your" WiFi, but not their wifi roaming "feature". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_earlsquareling Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 Using wifi analyzer i determined that somewhere around 3 and 9 were the most clear channels so i put them there. Main router around 3 and the guest around 9. I don't remember exactly. Its been a couple months since ive looked at it. My reasoning for that was i saw there was some bleed over into other channels so i thought there was not enough room below 1 or over 11. I really dont understand what happens to the signals in those ranges. So i gave them buffer from the edge. Note: In my old house i was using auto selection. My c7 does dual 5/2.4ghz and i allow it to do both. Unfortunately i have to be in the same room as the router to get a consistant signal from 5ghz. Otherwise i would just do use that for my private network. I opted to buy my own modem when i first got my internet connection and i use the motorola surfboard. No wifi, no switch, just a modem. Good suggestions, unfortunately they dont help ky situation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Jason Marsh Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Hmm. IDK.. my 5GHz works at the corners of my 2.5 acre property, but I'm in a wood-framed house built in the 90's. The place you're in, is it an ICF (insulated concrete form), or does the drywall have a foil lining on one side? I've seen foiled drywall, and the concrete in an ICF holds a lot of water. Either would cause problems with WiFi, either due to attentuation or reflections, but they're not terribly common in most of the US. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_earlsquareling Posted January 21, 2016 Author Share Posted January 21, 2016 My house was built in the 60's and im not sure about the drywall contents. The garage is attached and the living area is kind of L shaped around the garage. To get a direct line of sight to the router you have to go through the garage. In the bedrooms which are on the other side of the router (garage is not in between) i seem to get a decent 5ghz signal. Im at the point of giving up. But hopefully soon i will be done working on my man cave and i will move one router to the basement. Right not there is not much in the way of electrical sockets though so i might have to save up to have an electrician put some in. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Thomas Brisco Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Before giving up; you mentioned you looked at the channels, but I'm not clear if you checked the signal strength as well? My usual tool is my android phone with WiFi analyzer to check signal strength and channel allocations. Also; run a sniffer - and make sure you're not having traffic problems (I have a printer that occasionally loses it's mind, and ties up my whole network with DLNA broadcasts) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_Jason Marsh Posted January 21, 2016 Share Posted January 21, 2016 Well, I doubt you have foil-backed drywall in that home, then. 5GHz is going to be problematic after the second or third wall it has to go thru, but 2.4 should work ok, if and only if it's not competing with devices on adjacent channels. If you can turn down the transmit power, that can help. With PowerLine Networking, you could put a low-powered AP elsewhere in the house that you need coverage. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
G+_earlsquareling Posted January 22, 2016 Author Share Posted January 22, 2016 Idk how to post a picture on mobile and i dont feel like using an image host. My routers were at -25db and while the neighbors at -61db and lower. This was before i moved the routers to the center of the house. Also the channels are 8 and 3 for mine and the neighbors mostly at channels 1 and 11. I thought about a device run amok using all the bandwidth but how would it affect both routers? Especially when one of the routers only has 1 device connected most of time and i turned it off diring testing. In fact i tried turning off all wifi devices i saw in my routers list of connected devices and it still didnt help. What has changed in the routers since the move that they now interfere with each other? Maybe my old house is somehow perfectly aligned with the stars To allow such a thing. Has anyone else ever ran two routers/access points less than 3ft apart from each other without issue? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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