I just watched the latest episode & there was a section where Myriam Joire talks about how the on...

[G+_Ken H]

I just watched the latest episode & there was a section where Myriam Joire talks about how the only one to get payments right is Apple Pay. One thing she doesn't mention is that any Apple Pay terminal takes Google Wallet. I know this for sure because Panera Bread recently had big signs up for Apple Pay & nothing about Google Wallet but I was able to buy lunch using my Nexus 5 there a few wells back.

 

What I'm more excited about (even though I don't have a device that uses this) is Samsung Pay since it won't depend on these special terminals (which you all did mention). Once more phones can do this I would think mobile payments using just the phone in your pocket will take off. As it is now you never know if a shop will have the terminals or the trained staff (who should know that the terminals need to be turned on... grrr) to take advantage of the tech

[G+_Joseph Cappellino]

I haven't watched the episode, yet, but there are three main differences between Google Wallet and Apple Pay:

 

1) Apple Pay uses the Secure Element.  This used to be the case in Google Wallet, but T-Mobile, AT&T and Verizon were starting SoftCard (then ISIS) and wouldn't allow the app to be installed on their devices (though a rooted workaround was found).  The main benefit here is that there is no need for an Internet connection, which is now required for Google Wallet to work.  But, one of the downsides is that if you don't clear the Secure Element data before a factory reset, there's a chance that you will never be able to access the Secure Element again.  This affects both Apple Pay and the old Google Wallet.*

 

2) Apple Pay randomizes the card number.  Though Google Wallet uses a virtual card, the card number is always the same.  Whereas, Apple Pay has a one-time use number for each transaction.

 

3) Apple Pay can use biometrics to secure the payment.  TouchID makes this really simple for the end-user, but it has the same PIN failover as Google Wallet.

 

* Now that Google bought SoftCard, I wonder if there is a chance that they utilize the Secure Element again, and have a backup of HCE (Host Card Emulation).  This would give you the benefits of both (no network requirement, and if you fry the SE you can still use HCE).

[G+_Joseph Cappellino]

Andrew Uschold - The real downside now is CurrentC.  Both CVS and 7-11 are part of it, so neither Google Wallet nor Apple Pay work at it anymore.  This happened the day before Apple Pay launched.

 

Apparently, Best Buy is being the good-guy here.  They are enabling their terminals to accept both CurrentC and Apple Pay/Google Wallet.  Small victories.

[G+_Joseph Cappellino]

Andrew Uschold - The original implementation of Google Wallet used the Secure Element (which is why it was denied on Verizon, AT&T and T-Mobile, but accepted on Sprint).  Also, I know about this first hand, as I had to root my Verizon SGS4 to get it to work.

 

Whereas, the new implementation uses HCE (Host Card Emulation) so any device running 4.4+ with NFC can use Google Wallet.

[G+_Joseph Cappellino]

Andrew Uschold - You can find it here [1] under More secure payments.

 

[1] - https://www.apple.com/iphone-6/apple-pay/

[G+_Ian Wilkinson]

Why bother paying with your phone when you can just touch pay with your debit card?

Takes about 10 seconds.

[G+_Joseph Cappellino]

Ian Wilkinson - because the phone is more secure (at least in the US), as it's secured with a PIN.

[G+_Ian Wilkinson]

Joseph Cappellino fairnuff, if you want security you have chip and pin.

 

Not sure what the US is like but over here chip and pin has been the way to pay for about 5 years, touch pay had been about for around a year to 18 months and allows transactions up to £20.

[G+_Joseph Cappellino]

Ian Wilkinson - yeah, it's still signature based here, so the security is pretty lacking. :-/

[G+_Ian Wilkinson]

Joseph Cappellino Heehee, can't remember the last time I signed for something. Not sure my card even has a signature on the back...

 

When we moved to chip and pin it felt twice as fast as the old signature method, touch pay is at least two to three times faster than that.

[G+_Paul Werner]

One thing I wanted to add too is that even though I don't doubt TouchID is more "friction-less" when you pay using Google Wallet it's not difficult either. You don't even need to open the app before putting your phone to the terminal. You do need to put in your PIN (unless you just put it in prior to the purchase and happen to not be in the Wallet app by the time you are touching the phone to the terminal) but I wouldn't say putting in a 4 digit pin is difficult.

 

Interesting that it needs a network connection now because I remember doing transactions without it before. At the same time though that was way back when I still had the Sprint GS2 variant with the slide out keyboard and had to use my N7 2012 to try out Google Wallet purchasing. Early days there though.

[G+_Paul Werner]

Oh I totally forgot now since it was long ago. Thought it was GS1, my fault

[G+_Mic Cullen]

Watching this from Australia, where we have had NFC-equipped credit/debit cards for the best part of a decade (contactless payments), and we got rid of "sign for" credit cards years ago, is quite amusing :-)

 

And given how many countries have also had this tech for so long, it's amazing to watch the furore that "chip and pin" cards have caused in the US, especially given the security implications. (Also, the stupid proprietary systems designed to lock people into one system or another? #deadset)

[G+_L I]

Joseph Cappellino spot on about Secure Element vs HCE. To me that and Touch ID are the two most glaring advantages of Apple Pay. I was pretty upset when Google dropped support for secure element on older Nexus phones. I'm not too fussed about the pin number but I can see hour it introduced friction.

 

Another point about the Apple one-time-use card number vs Google same virtual card number is that if you're worried about data aggregation techniques the stores use with their MAC address tracking etc. then it's one more tool stores can use to track you across visits and across stores.

[G+_L I]

Mic Cullen chip and pin sounds like the way to go but we are too slow on the uptake here because of the squabbling over who pays for the upgrades. I think it took the massive breaches (the ones before 2014) to get these guys into line - and it still isn't chip/pin it's only chip/sign. Oh well.